Religion

AtheistCrusader

(33,982 posts)

78. I disagree.

Wed Oct 23, 2019, 12:15 PM

Oct 2019

Simply knowing it provably exists does not imply anything like faith.

"Faith, derived from Latin fides and Old French feid, is confidence or trust in a person, thing, or concept. In the context of religion, one can define faith as confidence or trust in a particular system of religious belief. Religious people often think of faith as confidence based on a perceived degree of warrant, while others who are more skeptical of religion tend to think of faith as simply belief without evidence."

Confidence/Trust is much more than simple existence (and proof/certain knowledge thereof).

I would have no confidence and no trust in the christian biblical character of 'god', even if I knew for certain it existed.

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80 replies

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Theism is delusion [View all] edhopper Oct 2019 OP

Guess I need to be reminded as to what theism is all about Zambero Oct 2019 #1

a belief in gods. Voltaire2 Oct 2019 #5

Yes, but also a particular type of creator/interventionist god(s) Major Nikon Oct 2019 #19

not really, that is just one variant Voltaire2 Oct 2019 #20

I'm just saying that in order to be any kind of theist requires a couple of additional steps Major Nikon Oct 2019 #23

What is truth? C_U_L8R Oct 2019 #2

"Beauty is truth, truth beauty" edhopper Oct 2019 #11

There is god C_U_L8R Oct 2019 #12

Or not. Act_of_Reparation Oct 2019 #16

Truth is what, as a society, defines Cartaphelius Oct 2019 #80

Hot potato there! Newest Reality Oct 2019 #3

Theism: edhopper Oct 2019 #13

If by theism one means a god-being then yes clearly it is a delusion. Voltaire2 Oct 2019 #4

Apparently you are doing it wrong... NeoGreen Oct 2019 #6

Correct. trotsky Oct 2019 #8

Squishy post-enlightement apologetics are really no different from traditional apologetics. Act_of_Reparation Oct 2019 #17

totally agree. Voltaire2 Oct 2019 #18

What evidence would be sufficient... NeoGreen Oct 2019 #7

Hi edhopper - thank you for posting this interesting topic. Pendrench Oct 2019 #9

Thank you for not being offended edhopper Oct 2019 #14

Hi edhopper - I didn't see anything offensive about your question. Pendrench Oct 2019 #15

Try removing your emotional attachment and looking at it another way Major Nikon Oct 2019 #24

Hi Major Nikon - thank you for taking time to respond to my post. Pendrench Oct 2019 #32

Sounds a bit like doubt Major Nikon Oct 2019 #35

Hi Major Nikon - Thank you for your reply. Pendrench Oct 2019 #37

Exactly the opposite. Sorry for the misunderstanding. Major Nikon Oct 2019 #43

Hi Major Nikon - My apologies to you for misunderstanding your reply! Pendrench Oct 2019 #45

If you believe in a trickster god who doesn't particularly care for humanity... trotsky Oct 2019 #10

"All religion is delusion" said Freud. Bretton Garcia Oct 2019 #21

Theism essentially makes 3 progressively incredible claims Major Nikon Oct 2019 #22

Absolutely. (n/t) Iggo Oct 2019 #25

One of the unpleasant things from the get-go is the definition of theism... RockRaven Oct 2019 #26

Read Yuval Noah Harari's 21 Lessons for the 21st Century. applegrove Oct 2019 #27

I think it is. I am a Buddhist. Buddha said that greed, hate and delusion are not wasupaloopa Oct 2019 #28

Thanks for this thoughtful reply. edhopper Oct 2019 #31

Hi wasupaloopa - thank you for sharing this. Pendrench Oct 2019 #33

Why is ''I don't know" never a legitimate answer? YOHABLO Oct 2019 #29

It's perfectly edhopper Oct 2019 #30

Certainty in asserting the unprovable is delusion. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #34

So there are no religious beliefs that are delusions? edhopper Oct 2019 #36

My statement stands. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #38

And people who say their faith tells them edhopper Oct 2019 #39

The key word is faith. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #40

That's delusional edhopper Oct 2019 #41

The delusion may come when one is certain without proof. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #42

You don't want to answer if SOME theist are delusional then. edhopper Oct 2019 #46

My responses applied to theists and non-theists. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #47

So anyone with an absolute belief that God exists edhopper Oct 2019 #48

Anyone who does not recognize the limitations of belief. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #49

Then the formula is not balanced, as you pretend it is. AtheistCrusader Oct 2019 #70

I never link faith with proof. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #71

I feel like I'll be using your words a lot against you when we touch on 'proof' and 'certainty'. AtheistCrusader Oct 2019 #72

Faith requires no proof. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #73

Proof does not abrogate faith. They can be compatible. AtheistCrusader Oct 2019 #74

If the Creator was visible, and knowable to us, guillaumeb Oct 2019 #75

I disagree. AtheistCrusader Oct 2019 #78

Yes, we disagree. guillaumeb Oct 2019 #79

If you assert Russell's teapot isn't real, you are delusional Major Nikon Oct 2019 #44

Howard Dean says Bill Barr is delusional edhopper Oct 2019 #50

Last time I checked I could neither prove nor disprove Cary Oct 2019 #51

God aside, there are many, many religious beliefs edhopper Oct 2019 #52

True Cary Oct 2019 #53

It's a belief system that takes the place of what we don't know. docgee Oct 2019 #54

Plenty of people use theism in place of what we DO know. Act_of_Reparation Oct 2019 #55

You seem to be describing the "God of the Gaps"... NeoGreen Oct 2019 #56

Seems to be less of a delusion to buy into the mythology completely Major Nikon Oct 2019 #58

God of the gaps, yes. docgee Oct 2019 #61

Privilege Major Nikon Oct 2019 #65

Very true. Good point. docgee Oct 2019 #66

Religious belief isn't hypothesis Major Nikon Oct 2019 #57

Perhaps, but think about 3000 years ago the people who wondered why it rained. docgee Oct 2019 #60

It is incorrect to label any of their 'guesses' or 'speculation' about reality as a hypothesis... NeoGreen Oct 2019 #63

What you describe is mythology, not hypothesis Major Nikon Oct 2019 #64

It appears you and NeoGreen are correct: docgee Oct 2019 #68

2300 years ago people were thinking critically Voltaire2 Oct 2019 #67

The problem was then as it is now Major Nikon Oct 2019 #69

God of the gaps. Voltaire2 Oct 2019 #59

...and that god keeps getting smaller and smaller and smaller... Iggo Oct 2019 #62

It feels like it's generally true. dchill Oct 2019 #76

Deity is a concept vlyons Oct 2019 #77