Is this enough? 50+ dead, 200+ wounded.

[krispos42]

44. Sorry for the delay, but let's talk some more

This is a bit too involved for a phone-written reply, and it was a busy weekend (wedding to attend).

But now I'm wondering which semi automatic rifles are able to be bump fired, or what (approximate) percentage of the total semi auto rifle stock is able to be bump fired, any idea?

Pretty much all of them. Basically, you need something firm that the trigger can be pressed up against, then you steadily pull (or push, I guess) the gun up against this firm object until the trigger trips. If there's enough give in your grip, the gun will recoil backwards (away from the firm object) enough to reset the trigger. The steady pull (or push) will pull the gun forward, the trigger will hit the firm object, and the cycle repeats.

It can be done by sticking your thumb through a gun's triggerguard and hooking it into your belt, then pulling forward with your support hand.

Is there a qualification for a rifle to be bump fired? must it have a minimum recoil - related to muzzle velocity I would think.

It's some combination of recoil force, gun weight, and trigger pull. If the recoil is very light it might be very hard to pull on the gun with "just enough" force to make the cycle repeat. Pull too hard and the trigger won't reset; not hard enough and the trigger won't trip after resetting. The heaviness of the trigger affect that as well. For a low-recoil gun (like a .22 rimfire) I imagine it's a fairly narrow range.

I would think most all of the past classes of banned assault rifles in the several states would be able to be bump fired, including ar15 & ak47 & mk5, even with the ar15's relatively weak recoil.
But what about the standard hunting rifle? like any of these 10 most popular hunting rifles (seems #6 probable);
https://www.outdoorlife.com/blogs/hunting/10-best-deer-guns-hunting-today

Yes, all the semi-automatic rifles that were banned as "assault weapons", as well as the ones that are the same thing but minus the cosmetic features that make them "assault rifles" can be bump fired. This is also true of semiauto rifles that are not and never have been classified as "assault weapons" (such as the M1 Garand). Only semi-automatics can be bump-fired, but pretty much all semiautos can be bump-fired. Nothing on that list except #6 is semiautomatic, so only #6 can be bump fired.

A marginal improvement is generally the best gun control efforts can expect. At least a marginal improvement is better than shoulder shrugging nra style, smirking inside, since they've already unleased their wolves & have little remorse for all the dead cattle the past 30 years. Is why background checks, high capacity magazine bans should be the least congress should stand for - republicans that is since most all dems do.

Except that treating the issue as a hardware problem isn't going to get us anywhere, I don't think, except put Republicans in charge of things.

People that do this sick things don't have much in the way of goals except cause as much carnage as possible before they are caught, or kill themselves. These sick people aren't going to go "well, I want to go kill of bunch of innocent people but I only have 10-round magazines, so that's just not going to happen".

Hardware is of course a component of these kind of senseless events, but the major components are really target selection and planning. The Vegas shooter, planned this weeks or months in advance, in classic "lone wolf" style. Tens of thousands of people in a packed mass, loud music, and an unobstructed vantage point far above the crowd. Days to cart in a couple of dozen rifles and thousands of rounds of ammunition. Hotel room rental. Getting his girlfriend out of the country and wiring money to her. All without the traditional warning signs... rants on social media or to friends and family, joining a militia or some other paramilitary group, appearing at gatherings of like-minded people, recruitment by some religious extremist group, etc.

The Miami shooter chose a packed nightclub for a 3-hour rampage.

The Aurora shooter chose a packed movie theater on opening weekend of a major action movie.

The Sandy Hook Elementary shooter picked a grade school full of gentle teachers and helpless kids in a brick box.

The Charleston Church shooter picked a bible-study class at a church.

The Virginia Tech shooter chained the doors shut at a college dorm.

And so on.


It's a depressing list. And yet, for every person killed with a rifle, 20 are killed with a handgun. Nearly all gun-related murders are single-victim homicides with only a few rounds fired. Focusing on the hardware doesn't change the overall numbers but it does get people like Trump, McConnell, Brownbeck, and hundreds more in office and in power.

Losing ObamaCare will kill thousands of Americans a year. War with North Korea and/or Iran will also kill thousands of Americans a year. Gutting the EPA will eventually kill thousands of Americans a year in very slow, gruesome, and family-crushing ways. Making abortions virtually illegal will kill hundreds or thousands of Americans a year. And for every American killed, dozens will be damaged and their lives reduced.

I don't have any answers to stopping random mass shootings. I don't think anybody does, short of complete confiscation of anything produced after 1840. And even then we'd have the occasional terrorist with a smuggled-in Kalashnikov shooting up a mall for one dumbass reason or another.

There is stuff we can do to reduce the many, many single-victim homicides that go largely under the radar, but it's not going to be addressed at all by assault-weapon bans and magazine limits.

I have no objection to limiting gun purchases to 12 per year; I feel if you're buying more than that, get some kind of permit. Either you're a collector or you're running an under-the-table gun shop. Note this is not quite the same as one-per-month, in that is allows people to pick up several guns at once. But each time you buy a gun you get a point that takes a year to go away, and you can't have more than 12 points.

I also don't really have a problem with having people get a permit to buy guns, presuming the issuing of such permits is done at reasonable cost and within a reasonable amount of time. I got my concealed-pistol permit a few months ago, and with it I can buy guns on the spot; the retailer just called a number to confirm my permit is still in good standing. I just doubt the good faith of New York, California, New Jersey, Massachusetts, and a few other states to do so. It took over six weeks to get my permit approved at the cost of several hundred dollars (plus the cost of the safety class), which seems a little over the top. I'm pretty sure that, nowadays they can know about me in six minutes, not six weeks.

This has the side-effect of making private gun sales go through a background check as well. When I bought a gun from a coworker we both had to fill out a transfer form, which included our personal information and permit numbers, and mail it in to the State Police.


But this is not what gets discussed; it's all about hardware bans!