Matt Orfalea Doesn't Work for the Sanders Campaign

[Don1]

He was fired after a day. It is unknown who he works for. Blasting all alleged Bernie supporters based on what that idiot says is unhelpful and even I will say prejudicial. We Democrats do not accept prejudice nor discrimination nor hasty generalizations about entire groups of people. It isn't part of our core principles.

It also isn't helpful or practical right now. We need progressive votes. No, no, it's more than that. Progressives are DAMN RIGHT about a lot of things. It's not merely that we need their voters, it's that we SHARE THEIR VALUES.


Unity.

[Me.]

1. If You Don't Want To Be Associated With Someone Say So

Silence usually signals assent.

[Don1]

2. He was fired.

[Me.]

3. Action Need To Be Matched With Words

[LongtimeAZDem]

5. Exactly

[The Magistrate]

7. Stop Defending Him, Sir

It is easily done.

When has Sanders ever denounced the slurs and smears and grotesque lies employed on his behalf by numerous persons presenting themselves as being in support of him?





"When things are not called by their right names, what is said cannot make sense. When what is said does not make sense, what is planned cannot succeed. When plans do not succeed, people become uneasy. When people are uneasy, punishments do not fit crimes. When punishments do not fit crimes, people cannot know where to put hand or foot."

[Me.]

9. ...

[LongtimeAZDem]

11. ...

[OKNancy]

4. Oh dear. I just looked at his twitter account

He's about as awful as they come. Good thing he is not working for Sanders. Too bad he is so hateful in his support for Bernie.

[Don1]

6. He is causing division.

It is unknown who he works for.

Division is his goal.

Labeling all Bernie supporters as him ensures the same goal--division.

[LongtimeAZDem]

10. It's a reasonable inference when those who DO work for the Sanders campign say the same things:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287701289

[Demsrule86]

17. Bri Bri is sending Fox videos out on Twitter. She works for him.

[LongtimeAZDem]

18. Exactly my point; when someone attempts to say that it's unfair to label all supporters like him,

the argument fails because officials of the campaign ARE like him.

[George II]

46. Jane Sanders' glowing tweet three months after he was "fired"...

Note: "ONCE AGAIN"!

[msongs]

8. "progressive votes" as opposed to what? no candidate has a claim to that mantra vs

everyone else. maybe it's actually that they share OUR values

[Don1]

13. Saying he works for Sanders when he doesn't is not cool.

And it's not good or part of OUR VALUES to claim that all Bernie supporters are representative of his divisiveness.

Is it part of YOUR VALUES?

Unity.

[Demsrule86]

19. Jane Sander has retweeted and like his videos. He was hired by the campaign and when some of his

really shitty videos surfaced...was fired. But there is still liking and retweeting. Personally I will ignore these folks who are members of the Green Party anyway.

[George II]

47. Example:

[George II]

28. So, are Orfalea's and Gray's and Sirota's values YOUR VALUES? Do you agree with their tactics....

....or like what they've said about Biden and the Democratic Party? Even though Sanders has withdrawn they're still at it today. Check their tweets.

[TwilightZone]

12. No one is blaming all Sanders supporters for this idiot.

That assertion got tiresome about five years ago.

As for Orfalea, Sanders would do well to distance himself from Matt. Instead, Jane Sanders and others in his campaign retweet his bullshit. Perhaps if you truly have a problem with him, you should take it up with them.

This type of nonsense has been happening the entire campaign. Welcome to the club.

[Me.]

14. And There-in Is The Hypocrisy

"Jane Sanders and others in his campaign retweet his bullshit"

[LongtimeAZDem]

16. "Not All Sanders Supporters" is very much the same as the misogynistic "Not all men" arguments

The point is not that it is ALL of them; the point is that those supporters who are NOT like that have the duty to speak out against those who are, starting at the top.

[DenverJared]

15. He was fired by the campaign and then rehired by Jane Sanders

[LizBeth]

20. I thought I had heard he was rehired about a month or so ago.

[NurseJackie]

21. He was fired by the campaign and then rehired by Jane Sanders

Thank you.

I'll never forgive Jane for her election-day tweet that was giving people "permission" to NOT vote for our party's nominee.

She couldn't bring herself to simply say "Vote for the Democrat"... so she tweeted some interesting election day advice to her twitter followers. Basically, it seems to me that she was expressing her belief that it was okay to not vote for the party's nominee... as long as the person voted and "followed their heart".



So... with that as a historical reference, it makes perfect sense that she'd rehire him.

[Celerity]

22. link please that proves he was 'then rehired by Jane Sanders' TIA

NurseJackie

21. He was fired by the campaign and then rehired by Jane Sanders

he was fired, yes, but I see nothing stating he was rehired

I can find nothing showing this, just people claiming it with no proof, and/or using hedged wording.

[LongtimeAZDem]

23. I don't belive that claims that he was actually put back on the paroll are correct, but so what?

He is clearly working for them, regardless; they hired him once, they know who he is, they retweet his comments, their own comments echo his, and they have NEVER rebuked him.

[NurseJackie]

24. Thank you.

It would be bad enough to simply remain silent... but they RETWEET! Obviously they approve.

[Celerity]

26. retweet does not mean a re-hire, there is a big difference, and you claimed he was re-hired

by Jane Sanders. All I asked for was proof of that claim, nothing more, nothing less.

[Celerity]

25. that is not what was claimed. sorry, and now you claim he is 'working' for them, as opposed to

still simply supporting Sanders.

I am sure he still supports Sanders ideologically, but retweets do not mean employment, which is what was claimed.

words and proof matter, at least they do for me

If the shoe was on the other foot and claims (with no proof so far) were made by Sanders supporters that cast Biden in a very negative light, then there would be (rightly so) a massive amount of pushback.

[LongtimeAZDem]

29. Again. so what; his words are despicable, and the Sanders campaign re-tweets them. Your attempt

to minimize this by hanging on that point are, IMO, rather sad.

And the whataboutism doesn't work; the fact is that the Biden campaign is NOT doing any such thing, where the Sanders campaign has, from the stat, and continues to do so.

[NurseJackie]

30. He's working for them. It's obvious.

Others are very carefully splitting hairs, thus revealing a position of weakness. He was "let go" (wink wink) uh-huh, right. Jane's got this taken care of.

[Celerity]

31. Objective truth matters.

You also misuse the term whataboutism, btw. I used a hypothetical example, not a real instance, and certainly was not using it to excuse anything, which is the very essence of whataboutism.

[LongtimeAZDem]

33. You made the point of his actual employment; your continued arguing only serves to deflect from the fact

that his posts are clearly representative of the Sanders campaign's tactics.

[Celerity]

34. I deflected from nothing. I asked for simple proof of a statement that I can find none for. nt

[The Magistrate]

35. She Is Correct, Sir, On The Point She Makes

I do not doubt her report, she is a formidable researcher.

The man in question may be representative, he may be frequently re-tweeted, by the candidate's spouse, even, he may enjoy 'favor at court', so to speak.

But he is not presently employed....





"When things are not called by their right names, what is said cannot make sense. When what is said does not make sense, what is planned cannot succeed. When plans do not succeed, people become uneasy. When people are uneasy, punishments do not fit crimes. When punishments do not fit crimes, people cannot know where to put hand or foot."

[LongtimeAZDem]

37. Quite correct; I acknowledged that in post #23

[The Magistrate]

39. Fair Enough, Sir --- I Had Not Noted The Earlier Comment

I agree he has evident associations with the campaign, but these do fall short of employment.

[lapucelle]

42. Jane promoted his "work" in January.

[Celerity]

43. I knew that already, but a retweet does not mean he was re-hired by Sanders, which was claimed and

what I was asking for proof of.

Thanks.

[lapucelle]

44. I wonder why Jane deleted her tweet.

Link to tweet

[George II]

27. First, no one blasted "all alleged Bernie supporters", the OP that you're presumably referring to...

....was about Sanders STAFFERS, who include "informally" Matt Orfalea, the man who was hired and then fired the next day for a sleazy and obscene video using MLK's "I have a dream" speech as the theme.

But he's still churning out venom against Biden and Jane Sanders has praised such efforts more than once.

That you take the comments about Orfalea and OTHER high up staffers like Gray and Sirota as "generalizations about entire groups of people" is a bit extreme. The fact remains that those three, even after Sanders has nominally suspended his campaign, are still running rampant on Twitter. In fact Gray has even stepped it up today.

As far as those three are concerned, I know that I DO NOT share their values, and from the reactions here in DU many others don't, either.

[Don1]

36. Matt what's-his-face is not a Sanders staffer.

Therefore, any THEY in reference to him cannot be about Sanders staffers. Moreover, even IF HE WERE A STAFFER, most of the staffers asked Bernie to concede which is why he did. They are a diverse group of people. Pretending they are a monolithic group of people is impractical toward our goal AND it is not a Democratic core principle. We do not accept prejudicial judgments about entire groups of people. The primary is over. We need to move forward and drop grudges and negative attacks. I've explained how to do it in a logical manner.

[The Magistrate]

38. You Press Well In Advance Of The Evidence, Sir

You do not know that 'most of the staffers requested Bernie to concede'. There have been reports of a total of three doing so, that began emerging a day or two ago. They were highly placed, and one was of long standing, but that hardly establishes 'most of the staffers' so urged Sanders. You do not even know their urgings are why Sanders acted as he did, and spoke as he did. It may be a reasonable surmise, but it is far from certain fact, given what has been made public to date.

The fellow with the name not worth learning to spell is not currently employed by Sanders, but he certainly enjoys 'favor at court', and people close to Sanders have amplified his voice. It would be foolish to attempt denial that he is typical of a goodly number of people proclaiming themselves supporters of Sanders on social media, in his extravagant lying and his reckless nihilism, which can only benefit the cheap thug Trump, and will do nothing to advance 'progressive' influence or policies. Persons still employed by Sanders have consistently posted up comments indistinguishable from his, and re-tweeted comments indistinguishable from his. One leading spokesperson just today is echoing and amplifying attack lines put into circulation on Daily Caller by Tucker Carlson.

People are generally fairly specific in their comments on the lies and smears and slurs engaged in by some supporters of Sanders. Those who misbehave are attacked. People have a choice whether to identify with the pedlars of lies and smears and slurs, and are not required to cry out that they are attacked themselves when such miscreants are described and denounced. That is a choice, but people who make it are consciously ranging themselves alongside these creatures, and cannot much complain if they come in for some of the righteous vitriol directed at the creatures they have leapt to defend. You could choose otherwise. You could denounce them as reckless and destructive elements, with whom you wish no association, and request Sanders do the same. Even if it means firing staff.

I will point out one more thing about the line you take. You have compared criticism of the excesses of people who lie and smear for Sanders with racism and tarring whole groups and similar tenditious nonesense. This is a common means employed to attack people on the left, who are supposed to be vulnerable to appeals to their better natures, and hear claims of the style you have adopted with an inclination to wonder 'do I want to be seen behaving like a racist?' It is a cheap trick that ought not to work so often as it does. I am immune to it, it does not bother me at all if someone thinks me a cruel and heartless beast, a hardened reprobate and foe of all that is holy by their lights. I know perfectly well who I am and what I am, and do not care a fig what you, or people with attitudes similar to yours, imagine me to be, or think it useful to picture me as.





"When things are not called by their right names, what is said cannot make sense. When what is said does not make sense, what is planned cannot succeed. When plans do not succeed, people become uneasy. When people are uneasy, punishments do not fit crimes. When punishments do not fit crimes, people cannot know where to put hand or foot."

[Don1]

40. Hasty generalizations about groups of people are a logical fallacy.

We do not need them in the Democratic Party.


Unity.

[The Magistrate]

41. So You Have No Rebuttal, Sir

That does not surprise me. My advice would be to find other hobbies, you really are not very good at this one....




I have found creating these both relaxing and enjoyable....





"When things are not called by their right names, what is said cannot make sense. When what is said does not make sense, what is planned cannot succeed. When plans do not succeed, people become uneasy. When people are uneasy, punishments do not fit crimes. When punishments do not fit crimes, people cannot know where to put hand or foot."

[George II]

45. They slyly have him working for them but not directly, due to his disgusting "I have a wet dream"...

...video. But but he still is working for the campaign.

Jane Sanders, months after he was "officially" fired, was still praising his work. She deleted her praising tweets, but one was captured (see below). Time to please stop making excuses for "staffers" "workers", "supporters", et. al. They've gathered a uniquely divisive group of people around themselves, and no amount of rationalization will change that. And pretending that someone, anyone, said they are a monolithic group of people is impractical toward out goal. And their continued divisive attacks on Biden and the Democratic Party is not a Democratic core principle.

[guillaumeb]

32. Well said.

We need each other.

[George II]

48. Orfalea's latest piece of work, posted on Twitter in the dead of night....

....dishonestly portraying this as a Biden ad. ALL lies.

Link to tweet