The Problem with the Latest Predictions for 'the Rise of the Religious Left'

[trotsky]

https://rewire.news/religion-dispatches/2019/01/28/the-problem-with-the-latest-predictions-for-the-rise-of-the-religious-left/

It’s common knowledge that the religious right played a large role in the election of Donald Trump in 2016. About 4 out of 5 white evangelicals voted for Trump and the majority continue to back him, even if explicit support may be slipping.

...Enter the so-called religious left. Last week NPR ran a story about the putative rise of a more left-leaning religious coalition in the United States. The story suggests that a “comparable effort by liberal religious leaders” to the formation of the Moral Majority some 40 years ago is now taking shape, “coalescing in support of immigrant rights, universal healthcare, LBGTQ rights and racial justice.”

...Tired of their faith being reduced to little more than conservative talking points, Christians of the religious left want the broader population to know that Christianity has more to it. Among other things, Christianity is eminently about social justice, a concern for the poor, marginalized, and oppressed. In a word, among the ranks of Christians are a good many “progressives.”

...The other problem with this framing is that it presupposes that there even is such a thing as an ‘essential’ or ’true’ Christianity. While Christianity isn’t endlessly subjective it would be extremely difficult to argue that a millennia-old world religion with its numerous cultural variations and scriptural interpretations can be reduced to ‘true’ and ‘not true’ forms. And it’s entirely possible that echoing the Christian right’s claims to represent a true Christianity only winds up bolstering such claims.

[Act_of_Reparation]

1. Different politics, same annoying tendencies.

Americans, broadly, are already positively disposed towards Christianity. Americans, broadly, are Christians. They don't need a condescending ex-hippy "cool pastor" to explain to them there is more to Christianity than Billy fucking Graham. They already know.

[marylandblue]

2. We are at a political crossroads

These sort of shifts happen every 40 years or so. Last one was 1980. Either the nation will turn sharply left, and Christianity will go left with it, or it will turn right into authoritarianism and we will be in a lot of trouble. I am an optimist so I see us turning left, but the struggle is now and the outcome uncertain.

[Cartoonist]

3. Since when?

Christianity is eminently about social justice, a concern for the poor, marginalized, and oppressed.
_

They must have started doing that after the Crusades. Or was that after the Spanish Inquisition? Maybe it was after Salem. Maybe they started doing that after the genocide of native people was complete. Maybe they'll start now that they put Trump in the White House.

The world is waiting for Christianity to start doing something about social justice, a concern for the poor, marginalized, and oppressed.

[NeoGreen]

5. I call BS...

...

Christianity is eminently about social justice, a concern for the poor, marginalized, and oppressed.

Its main points include: Belief in God the Father, Jesus Christ as the Son of God, and the Holy Spirit. The death, descent into hell, resurrection and ascension of Christ.

Everything else is tacked on and incidental.

I presume your quote above is not your POV, and apologies if I misread the intent of your post.

[safeinOhio]

18. There is a sect for everyone.

Unitarians don't buy the Trinity and Universalist don't believe in Hell.

Humanist and Ethical Society are very interesting.

[NeoGreen]

20. Okay...while derived, historically, from christian sects...

...unlike all remaining christian sects UU's don't have a creed. They, as a class, are not properly (i.e. no longer) identified as 'christian'.

While UU's likely have many members who label themselves as 'christian', UU as a religion has moved beyond unity/trinity, heaven/hell.

I'm not aware of remaining, after the merger in 1961, single case "Unitarians" or "Universalists" large enough for a general discussion of christian classes.

[Cartoonist]

22. Don't you know me?

I pulled that quote from the OP, thus my biting remarks.

[NeoGreen]

25. I must be having an "off" day...

...my apologies for my fog. I'll try to wake up or not...

[KansasKali]

4. If they can help get good people into office and bad people out.

Who cares?

[trotsky]

16. I guess you didn't read the article. n/t

[MineralMan]

6. If the Christian "Left" wants to do something, let it start by

pointing out why the Christian Right is the Christian Wrong. It's not really that difficult to find proof texts you can use to attack the bigotry, misogyny, anti-immigrant, anti-choice and anti-LGBTQ positions of the Christian Right. Use them, you Christian Leftists.

Call out the crap and tell people why it's crap. Then, once you get their attention, maybe you can sell your brand. Right now, the Christian brand is far, far right. You won't get far unless you start by calling out the bullshit.

Good luck with that. You're going to have to get over that "Judge Not" stuff and that "They're Christians, too" stuff.

[Pope George Ringo II]

7. They almost do this, just poorly.

"They're not xians." Unfortunately, after that dismissal, they've got nowhere else to go.

[MineralMan]

10. I know many Christians who are progressives.

Their single most glaring flaw is their refusal to attack other Christians who do horrible things. They'll attack politicians, but not on the basis of religion.

I understand it, given the warning not to judge in their scriptures, but that reticence to call out evil that ties itself to Christianity limits their effectiveness.

It has been a source of dispute between me and those Christians I know who are progressives for years. They will tell you what they are for, but will not go after other Christians who do the opposite of what they are for and who claim Christianity in support of their ugly positions.

That attitude weakens their influence, I believe.

[Pope George Ringo II]

12. Some do, no doubt.

But look at all of those who simply cannot grasp that their religion is involved with evil, let alone at least partially responsible for it.

[Major Nikon]

13. Many have ugly positions themselves

If you have a conversation with them about LGBT and/or women's rights you sometimes find at best they have a hard time criticizing those who use religion to marginalize those groups and at worst they still hold on to some of those ideas themselves because that's what the bible tells them.

[trotsky]

15. Problem is, there are plenty of verses and texts to support every Christian's position.

The left ignores the stuff about following Jesus or burning in hell.

The right ignores the stuff about loving their enemies.

Each group *knows* there are parts of the bible they don't believe in, but they have perfectly valid (in their minds) reasons to reject those parts. And so the stalemate continues, thanks to how religion works. You have "faith," you don't need evidence or reason.

[MineralMan]

19. That's because religion reflects culture.

That never changes. If a religion's scriptures don't have an answer for every question, the solution is to create more scripture. that's why the Bible is such a long book.

[zipplewrath]

8. I've heard this before

I think it was during the Clinton era. A supposed rise in evangelicals starting to adopt otherwise "lefty" causes as a rejection of the hate of the religious right. They were suppose to be friendlier to environmental causes, social causes for the poor, and supportive of anti-discrimination positions. I never really saw them materialize.

[Major Nikon]

9. There's other problems with this sort of wishful thinking

There's no reason to suspect any sort of "religious left" movement is going to be successful and more reason to believe it will just throw red meat to the fundies. But let's pretend for a moment such a movement were actually successful, would we really want it? Anytime you let religion in the door they will start to demand power in exchange for their support. An entity with political influence that demands morality based on a work of fiction written thousands of years ago is never a good idea. There's still no shortage of even left leaning religion that still teaches hate from the pulpit. Even if you could manage to move them forward off of so many bad ideas, you are still left with a group that will look for advice from mythical entities before they ever compromise on anything.

[Pope George Ringo II]

11. "Let's all work together to make my invisible friend happy" is a poor foundation.

It would be one thing if doing good was the foundation, but it's not.

[trotsky]

14. "they will start to demand power in exchange for their support"

Look at right here on DU with certain people who promote the "religious left" criticizing atheists for speaking their opinions lest we "scare away" potential Democratic voters. In other words, they want power over our voices in exchange for support of the progressive agenda.

[Major Nikon]

17. As I've always said, organized religion is the antithesis to progressivism

It doesn't really matter how well meaning they are. The fact is they will always be looking backward for ideas and they will always defend hocus pocus notions as a sacred cow (pardon the pun) which can only be criticized by other believers. Both of those things are counterproductive to progressivism.

[NeoGreen]

21. Do you have an opinion on...

...UU's? Do they fall into your generalization or are they a possible exception?

https://www.uua.org/

[Major Nikon]

23. My father was a UUA ordained minister

I was around his church all the time growing up. I even remember avowed atheist members of the congregation providing guest sermons occassionally.

I'm quite familiar with what they are and while they are certainly some of the most open minded of all denominations in the US, I still don't think they are an exception. They still base their core philosophy on scripture and they still tend to look backward rather than forward for answers.

[NeoGreen]

24. Fair enough...

...and I bow to your greater experience on this subject.

[Lordquinton]

26. Good answer

Every time this discussion comes up the UU are brought up as a sort of gotcha line. Best response is like you said "did I stutter?" Only with more tact and explaination.