"I think that's over." Gen. McCaffrey on NATO

[Kid Berwyn]

THIS bothers me.

'I think that's over': Retired general declares death of key U.S. alliance

by Sarah K. Burris
MSN.com, February 19, 2025

Retired General Barry McCaffrey said he thinks that after 76 years, the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, known as NATO, is "over."

Speaking on an MSNBC panel of foreign policy experts about President Donald Trump blaming Ukraine for Russia invading their border, McCaffrey lamented that he fears war is coming.

"Unfortunately, my own view is the damage is done," he said of Trump's failures in foreign policy. "It's now irrevocable. There's not a shred of rational argument among European powers to trust the United States' commitment to NATO and Article Five."

He remarked that NATO has served as "a deterrent organization" and "kept the peace for four generations."

"I think that's over," he confessed. "So, I think right now there's a scramble among all the European countries to include the Finns and the Swedes and others and who are borderline states, the Baltic states, Poland, etc., that they think they're under the gun."

Continued...

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/i-think-that-s-over-retired-general-declares-death-of-key-u-s-alliance/ar-AA1zonJm

Dunno about the rest of the United States of America, but when a traitor installed by Vladimir Putin orders me to turn on my friends of 75-years in NATO, I don't dump my friends.

Fuck Turncoat Trump!

[kentuck]

1. How long until they vote to remove the United States from NATO?

Then it will be over.

That could happen sooner than we may think?

[muriel_volestrangler]

4. This article (wondering about Turkey, in 2019) says there would have to be a material breach of the treaty

which might have to be an actual refusal to defend a fellow member, rather than palling around with dictators who have invaded a non-member country.

https://www.justsecurity.org/66574/can-turkey-be-expelled-from-nato/

If it just looks Trump would refuse to defend a member, that may not be enough (there's no formal process for expulsion).

[OMGWTF]

9. "Palling around with dictators" is what $arah Palin accused Obama of doing. Projection.

And she is actively trying to get a gig in this immoral, traitorous administration.

[DENVERPOPS]

43. She has had her day........

there are way too many other Republican Women, who are much prettier and stupider than Sarah, "putting out" to get close to Trump......(Not sure they could be stupider and less qualified than Palin but many have managed!)

They are all near getting to the age where they are over the hill, get a ton of plastic surgery, the pre-requisite required "Republican Rack" and trying to out do each other to get attention and worship Trump......

And the whores on E Colfax here in Denver have much higher morals than they all do.....There are things the whores WON'T do,
FOR ANY AMOUNT OF MONEY, unlike most Republican wannabes, esp the females.......

[DallasNE]

28. That General Idea Occurred To Me Today As Well

But with a little different phrasing.My exact thought was how long before the other NATO nations vote to suspend America from NATO.

[DENVERPOPS]

44. That would be disastrous

that is exactly what Trump and Putin would love, then Trump wouldn't have to do it and take hits from all of us, as well as crap from the rest of the world....
There is nothing to be gained by NATO throwing out the U.S. per se. Trump has already started to pull all aid from Ukraine, he will soon pull all aid from NATO countries, esp in the ones adjacent to Russia. Let Trump be the bad guy.....

Same with demonstrations to a certain extent........He wants to have a reason to enable the "Insurrection Act" to mobilize the U.S. Military for use against the U.S. citizens, establish Marshall Law, and ignore the Posse Comatatus act.

I watched what happened to protestors in Russia, protesting Putin's declaring war on Ukraine. There was a group of maybe a three hundred demonstrators. The Russian Military, surrounded them, corralled them, put them on trucks and I assume they were "disappeared" for their acting out.
When Trump watched that, he probably came in his diaper, in envy of Putin, and wanting to have that kind of power here in the U.S......

[Kid Berwyn]

30. US is the lynchpin of the Free World.

NATO will try to hold together until the next US election.

Thanks to corrupt NAZI loving billionaires like Harlan Crow and Elon Musk, the US is “led” by a traitor who will do all he possible to prevent them.

We the People — and our brothers and sisters in NATO — are what stand in his way.

[JustAnotherGen]

2. I believe the General

Is right.

[bluestarone]

3. Yep, scary when career Generals make statements like this.

Fucking religious right.

[Magoo48]

10. Ok, fucking religious right. Assholes all, no doubt about it.

But, why doesn’t our military denounce fascism, stand upon our constitution and stop this madness before some really bad shit hits the fan?

[bluestarone]

11. Maybe because the TRUE generals were FIRED?

They have full control of our military.

[Magoo48]

17. Grassroots are gonna decide over the next four years if will remain free or not.

Apparently, the military can only be saved from the bottom up as well.

[Arazi]

19. You have more faith in the average soldier understanding the nuances of orders from his/her CIC

I believe many will accept that their CIC knows what he’s doing and they’ll follow his orders.

Understanding the illegality of such an order won’t happen quickly enough (imo) within the timeframe between when the order is given and execution of those orders, so most will obey the orders.

A lot will depend on how fast Traitor manages to remove all independent, strong generals and officers. He’s not doing a great job endearing himself to his military atm so we have that going for us at least

[Kid Berwyn]

31. Really does look that way, "The American Pantagruel"

The American Pantagruel has declared himself the enemy of the United States.

LUCIAN K. TRUSCOTT IV
FEB 19, 2025

It took us just thirty days into the second administration of Donald J. Trump to reach a signature moment in American history. In calling Volodymyr Zelenskyy a dictator and accusing him of starting the war that his country has suffered through from Russian aggression for nearly three years, Trump has loudly and clearly taken the side of a real dictator against our ally, Ukraine. It's no longer as if Trump is acting like a Russian asset. He has raised the white, blue, and red flag of Russia over the White House. In military terms, Trump has switched sides and begun firing from Russian lines at American troops.

The United States began preparing for a land war in Europe with Russia's progenitor, the Soviet Union, 80 years ago at the end of the Second World War, when the Soviets militarily occupied the Eastern European nations which had been taken by the Nazis. The Soviets didn’t bother declaring them within their sphere of influence and immediately began treating them as client states. You need look no further than at photographs of Russian tanks on the other side of Checkpoint Charlie or rolling into Budapest in 1956 to put down the Hungarian Revolution for evidence of Russia's crimes against Eastern Europe.

In 1955, when my family debarked at Bremerhaven from a converted military troop ship called the General Patch, there were more than 300,000 American troops stationed in Germany, with about 70,000 more in France, and tens of thousands scattered around Italy, Great Britain, and other countries. We didn't arrive in Germany on a family vacation. My father commanded an infantry company in Stuttgart and was almost immediately put on alert and sent to the field for maneuvers and training that lasted for months at a time. My uncle James was an F-100 pilot assigned to fly missions along the border with Czechoslovakia to guard against encroachments by Soviet MiGs.

It was serious business to be assigned to combat units in Germany in the 1950s. The word that was used to describe the American military in Europe in those days was “tripwire.” The US Army and Air Force were stationed on European soil to deter the Soviet Union from turning the countries of Western Europe into more of its client states. The Soviet Union and its Communist leadership, headquartered in the Russian capital of Moscow, was the enemy of the United States.

Today, our enemy is the nation of Russia, led by its dictator, Vladimir Putin. If you have any question as to whether Russia has transformed itself into the enemy of Western Europe and the United States, all you have to do is look at the destruction Putin's military has wreaked on its much smaller neighbor, Ukraine, over the last three years, causing once again American military units assigned to Germany, Poland, and the Baltic states to be referred to as a tripwire.

The threat of Vladimir Putin’s Russia to Western Europe is so great and taken so seriously that Germany every year hosts the Munich Security Conference, attended by the secretaries of defense and military commanders of every country in NATO and the European Union. Those images you see in the papers or on television of European leaders around conference tables in Munich every year are not posed for show. Despite the juvenile presence of the American Vice President in Munich giving a speech that could have been written in Moscow, the security conference this year was especially serious for one reason: according to JD Vance and the drunken frat boy we have for a Secretary of Defense, Donald Trump decided to back Vladimir Putin and Russia against our allies in Ukraine. Listening to the words of Vance and Hegseth, no other conclusion can be drawn than that the United States is no longer acting as a member in good standing of NATO.

There is only one good thing about what Trump has done over the last two days. One of the readers of this column, Reed Bonadonna, put it better than I could in his comment today, which I will quote in full:

“As a military type, I feel a sense of excitement that the enemy has declared itself, looming like a hideous, toupéed Pantagruel. This, I begin to wondering see, is the battle for which we have always been preparing ourselves.”

Continues…

https://luciantruscott.substack.com/p/the-american-pantagruel-has-declared

[NoMoreRepugs]

5. The SlobFather desperately wants to be a wartime president and have

American tanks and artillery parade before him. I’ll remind DU of this post when it happens.

[Kid Berwyn]

32. Trump saluted a North Korean General

Deep down, Dim Donnie really does love a man in uniform.

[Hope22]

6. The world can't put up with a country that vacillates on a four year calendar.

Our militant right just returns to chaos something the rest of the world wants no part of. Four year policy does not allow for educational plans, family plans, job security. None of this is conducive to stability or peace of mind. Screw Congress. They continued to seat these monsters driving us further and further into the abyss. Cowards to the end. It will be interesting to see where and when these people flee the country.

[Kid Berwyn]

33. Recommend we hold the trials immediately after arrest.

Preserving the Constitution demands it.

[aggiesal]

7. Those of us that worked on ending the Cold War are distressed ...

I worked on 2 $py pl@ne$ in my career.
I was in Berlin from Jan. 1992 to Jun. 1994, first working with the British RAF, then working with the Luftwaffe.
I was acting as a liason/developer between my company & the 2 countries air forces, installing and maintaining equipment.
I had a very high U.S. Clearance that allowed me to view NATO documents.

I don't believe I"d have that ability to work at the base or to view any NATO documents.

Mierda47 is the biggest idiot in the world.
I will blame every one I know that voted for him, that this is their fault.

[Kid Berwyn]

34. Vielen dank fuer Alles.

My wife’s distant cousin devoted his professional career to help rebuild the Bundeswehr. Before he died, I had the honor to thank him personally for helping defend Democracy in Germany and for the Western Alliance.

No one in Germany could believe USA elected dip. And that was the first time.

[aggiesal]

35. They must have been in horror, the 2nd time. n/t

[Kid Berwyn]

39. Certain they are.

The family lost most everything in the war, except their goodness.

[OMGWTF]

8. Everyone hates us. Thanks to Shitler and Eloon we are now the "bad guys."

[Buddyzbuddy]

12. Thanks to half of this f.cking Country.

I'm so glad they love to advertise their devotion to the Felon. As I've stated before, it's an easier target. Keep a list because when things go down, so will their flags and signs. They will know what it is to be chased and have bounties on their heads.
Not by me of course. I'm a little old for offense but defense, I'm all in. Get used to this term, "the enemy of my enemy is my friend"

[Evolve Dammit]

24. Only took a few weeks too

[Kid Berwyn]

36. They really crawled out of the woodwork.

Harlan Crow’s dictator garden and other crimes against taste

by Tony Bravo,
Datebook/San Francisco Chronicle, April 22, 2023

When news of Texas billionaire Harlan Crow’s close, financially entwined friendship with Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas was revealed in a story by ProPublica, it wasn’t just the expensive gifts or luxury trips Crow gave the justice that caught my attention.

It wasn’t even the fact that the billionaire bought Thomas’ mother’s house and allows her to live there rent-free so he can one day turn it into a museum dedicated to the justice that I found most startling.

What astounded me was the extremely problematic (and very odd) collection that Crow exhibits at his Dallas estate and other properties.

I don’t mean his paintings by Renoir, Monet and Stuart, or the objects related to American history, like silver forged by Paul Revere and a helmet that belonged to President Dwight Eisenhower. It was the objects he’s collected that relate to some darker parts of history. In particular, the Nazi stuff.

Crow’s Third Reich collection is known to include an autographed copy of Hitler’s manifesto “Mein Kampf”; Hitler’s personal linens and tableware (decorated with Nazi symbols); and two paintings by the art-school reject who slaughtered millions while chancellor of Germany.

If you’re thinking that collecting Nazi memorabilia is a total nefarious-rich-person cliche, don’t worry. It gets weirder.

On the Dallas estate’s rear lawn is an area Crow has dubbed the Garden of Evil. It holds a collection of statues of former communist dictators including Vladimir Lenin, Joseph Stalin and Fidel Castro, as well as philosopher Karl Marx and Cuban revolutionary Che Guevara.

Continues…

https://datebook.sfchronicle.com/art-exhibits/harlan-crow-clarence-thomas-17905145

[Godot51]

13. The Russo/German pact of 1939.

It is certain that most Americans have never heard of the Russo/German Non-Aggression Pact of 1939.

We're on the edge of such a false alliance right now and neither leader is sane, trustworthy, nor able to understand the gravity of their foolishness.

[FakeNoose]

23. Hitler always planned to attack USSR eventually

Hitler just wanted that pact with Stalin in 1939 to buy some time. In 1939 and 40, the German army overran the countries east and west of Germany, after making alliances with Austria and Italy. THEN in 1941 Hitler attacked USSR, getting stuck over winter in Stalingrad, and losing half of his army. That was probably his biggest mistake, plus the fact that he refused to listen to his generals.

I'm not sure if Chump is planning anything like this, but if he is our military leaders would shut it down immediately.

We should be asking why is Chump doing all this to keep Putin happy?
What does Putin have on Chump that enables him to twist Chump's arm like this?
Why can't the MAGAs see that this is outright collaboration with a dangerous enemy?

[Evolve Dammit]

25. Really good questions. Wish I had the answers. Somebody does.

[rpannier]

27. I'm going with a less insidious theory

Trump is a lazy idiot and Putin knows it
Since no one in Putin's close circle dares utter any protected conversation, he and his Stalinesque cabal can sit and laugh at Trump while Trump thinks they're on the same side.
Trump isn't smart enough, nor savvy enough to even be Mussolini to Putin's Hitler. Trump is more an Ion Antonescu, or Ante Pavelić

[Kid Berwyn]

37. The parallels are striking.

GERMAN-SOVIET PACT

The German-Soviet Pact was signed in August 1939. It paved the way for Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union to invade and occupy Poland that September. The pact was an agreement of convenience between two bitter enemies. It permitted them to carve up spheres of influence in eastern Europe, while pledging not to attack each other for 10 years. Less than two years later, however, Hitler launched an invasion of the Soviet Union.

KEY FACTS

1.) This agreement is commonly referred to as the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact. It is also known as the Nazi-Soviet Pact or the Hitler-Stalin Pact.

2.) The arrangement included a 10-year non-aggression pact between Germany and the Soviet Union. It also called for economic cooperation and territorial expansion.

3.) The German-Soviet Pact prepared the way for World War II.

Source: https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/german-soviet-pact

All Ukraine’s rare earths are belong to us.

[chouchou]

14. Yes Yes! There nothing more stabilization then have most of the world terrified of what-the-fuck.

Every day is a crap shoot. ...Yes..I love to live that way!

[Kid Berwyn]

38. The Resistance Helped Stop The Invincible Imbeciles in WW2

Tears for fears

LUCIAN K. TRUSCOTT IV
FEB 20, 2025

The Munich Security Conference may as well have been held in the infamous Berlin suburb of Wannsee given the way that our sterling Vice President stepped into the shoes of Reinhardt Heydrich as he told the assembled European security officials that his boss Donald Trump had come up with a solution to what he might as well have called the Ukraine Question: sell 40 million people off to Trump's murderous pal, Vladimir Putin, let him order a great big Bucha and be done with them.

Reports from the conference said the attendees were in shock as Vance told them that they couldn't count on the United States to stand by its NATO treaty obligations in defense of its European allies. Vance might just as well have called out “so long Article 5” to his stunned audience on his way out the door.

It was left to the Security Conference Chairman, Christophe Heusgen, to try to make sense of what had just happened. Calling what he had heard from United States spokesmen a “European nightmare,” Heusgen lamented that “This conference started as a transatlantic conference, but after the speech by Vice President Vance on Friday, we must fear that our common value base is not so common anymore.” His voice breaking, the conference chairman could no longer continue. Beginning to cry, he walked away from the podium and embraced his wife in the front row of the audience. The conference attendees, who had begun applauding as Heugsen broke down in tears, fell silent.

Let me tell you why the tears of the Munich Security Conference Chairman did not shock me. It's because Europe is littered from North to South and East to West with the remnants and memories of the war that began 85 years ago and left not a town, not a street, not a building, not a human being untouched by the horrors wreaked upon a continent by one man with his insane prejudices and his army.

We all know of the American cemeteries filled with the white crosses and Stars of David that marked the graves of our fallen and the monuments that commemorate their valor. Our armies crossed an ocean to help conquer the Nazi hordes which sent millions to their deaths in concentration camps and killed millions more with bombs and rockets and artillery and machine guns and rifles. Millions of words have been written trying to make sense of what the Nazis did to the human beings and countries with whom they shared a continent and a history.

Continues…

https://luciantruscott.substack.com/p/tears-for-fears

As long as there are NAZIs, We the People must be the Marquis.

[chouchou]

40. My Husband and I almost broke down in tears ourselves,,

That's (by far) one-of-the-best posts I've ever seen on DU. You should put that on a featured post. Damn...wonderful.

[Xolodno]

15. Macron once pitched the idea of an EU Army.

They may go with it now. One thing the war in Ukraine has shown, the logistics of getting military aid there and the troops trained was a bit difficult. An EU army would standardize a lot so no matter what nation you are in, you will be able to drive that tank, fly that plane, etc.

It would also make them less reliant on purchasing US weapons if they develop their own. Of course our defense contractors won't be happy.

[R. P. McMurphy]

20. I wouldn't mind if it crippled the . . .

military/industrial complex in this country.

[Kid Berwyn]

41. Trump orders history rewrite to make out Russia as the victim.

US objects to phrase ‘Russian aggression’ in G7 statement on Ukraine

Trump administration splits with allies on holding Moscow responsible for war

Christopher Miller in Kyiv, Henry Foy in Brussels and Myles McCormick in Washington yesterday
Financial Times, February 20, 2025

The US is opposed to calling Russia the aggressor in a G7 statement on the third anniversary of Moscow’s full-scale invasion of Ukraine, threatening to derail a traditional show of unity, according to western officials.

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s participation at a virtual G7 summit on Monday has also not yet been agreed, officials said, while Italian Prime Minister Giorgia Meloni’s office announced she would not participate.

It comes after US President Donald Trump blamed Ukraine for the war, described Zelenskyy as a “dictator without elections” and suggested that Russia should be invited back into the G7.

The Trump administration doubled down on its criticism of Zelenskyy on Thursday, with national security adviser Mike Waltz accusing Kyiv of hurling “unacceptable” insults at the US president, and also demanding that Ukraine agree to a minerals deal.

Continues...

https://www.ft.com/content/73809e7a-a772-403a-8755-41a329d6a45d

[Martin Eden]

16. Canada is committed to NATO, and will be now more than ever

NATO will survive, but Trumpist America is heading towards pariah nation status.

[PortTack]

21. Agree...NATO will survive without the US. Putin will not be successful going up against a United EU

[DoBW]

18. Trump legacy in 4 words ...

Last edited Fri Feb 21, 2025, 10:52 AM - Edit history (1)

rapist, conman, felon, traitor ...and as noted over and over -- puppet

[Kid Berwyn]

46. An accurate epitaph of evil.

"What kind of psychopath poses with an infant whose parents were killed?"

It is the sort of photo politicians have long been known to favour: adorable baby, thumbs up, big smiles.

Few, however, would surely pose this way in such grave circumstances.

Donald Trump has sparked global revulsion after being photographed grinning with a two-month-old child who was made an orphan during Saturday’s mass shooting in El Paso which left 22 people dead.

The infant’s adopted parents, Andre and Jordan Anchondo, were both killed in the supermarket massacre, while he himself suffered broken bones when Ms Anchondo fell on the child to shield him from further bullets.

But when the baby, called Paul, was brought to the US president at the University Medical Center of El Paso, the 73-year-old appeared untouched by the child’s tragic plight. Both he and first lady Melania smiled for cameras, while the commander-in-chief also threw in a thumbs up.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/trump-melania-baby-el-paso-thumbs-up-hospital-parents-mass-shooting-a9049086.html

[UTUSN]

22. Knr

[Kid Berwyn]

45. Reuters: US & Russia holding secret talks in Switzerland

Americans, Russians have held undisclosed talks on Ukraine in Switzerland, sources say

By Gram Slattery and Emma Farge
February 21, 20257:04

Summary

* Talks described as 'Track Two' conversations
* Attendees not government officials, unclear if they were sent by governments
* Other details also unclear, including whether Ukrainians joined
* Geneva meeting coincided with Munich security gathering

WASHINGTON, Feb 20 (Reuters) - U.S. and Russian participants have met in Switzerland for unofficial talks about the Ukraine war in recent months, including as recently as last week, three sources with knowledge of the matter said.

While the attendees have diplomatic and security experience, they are not government officials and it was not immediately clear if any were sent by their governments, two of the sources said. The sources declined to identify the attendees.

Snip...

Trump, in office for just a month, has upended the U.S. approach toward the three-year-old Ukraine conflict, engaging directly with Russian President Vladimir Putin and pushing for a quick deal to end the war.

On Tuesday, top U.S. officials met with Russian officials in Saudi Arabia, including Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov (seen smiling, standing behind traitor trump in the OP).

One of the sources described the Switzerland talks as "Track Two" discussions - diplomatic parlance for unofficial dialogue geared toward improving communication and floating ideas, rather than developing concrete proposals.

Continues...

Source: https://www.reuters.com/world/americans-russians-have-discussed-ukraine-war-through-swiss-side-channel-sources-2025-02-20/

[Martin68]

26. They'll wait for us to deal with Trump. NATO needs us.

[Kid Berwyn]

49. May have started. After calling for Ukraine surrender, Kellogg pulls 180...

US envoy praises Zelenskyy after Trump’s censure of the Ukrainian leader

by Illia Novikov
Associated Press, February 21, 2025

KYIV, Ukraine (AP) — President Donald Trump’s envoy to Ukraine and Russia said on Friday that he had held “extensive and positive discussions” with Ukraine’s President Volodymyr Zelenskyy about the three-year war with Russia and praised the Ukrainian leader as an “embattled and courageous leader of a nation at war.”

Retired U.S. Lt. Gen. Keith Kellogg — who traveled to Kyiv on Wednesday and whose planned news conference with Zelenskyy on Thursday was changed at the last minute to a simple photo opportunity — struck a positive tone after what he said on the social platform X was “a long and intense day” of talks with Ukraine’s senior leadership.

His comments marked a departure from recent rebukes of Zelenskyy by Trump and other senior U.S. officials that appeared to indicate an abrupt deterioration of relations. Trump called Zelenskyy “a dictator without elections” and warned him that he’d “ better move fast ” to negotiate an end to the war or risk not having a nation to lead.

The possibility that vital U.S. military aid for Ukraine was in doubt darkened the mood in Kyiv as Ukrainian forces struggle to hold back Russia’s bigger army on the battlefield.

SNIP...

Polish President Andrzej Duda, whose country has been a vocal supporter of neighboring Ukraine, said Zelenskyy phoned him on Friday. Duda said he told Zelenskyy “to remain committed to the course of calm and constructive cooperation” with Trump.

“We consistently believe there is no other way to stop the bloodshed and achieve lasting peace in Ukraine except with the support of the United States,” Duda said he also told Zelenskyy.

Continues...

https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-zelenskyy-trump-0bc41d62c4fdfa00b4358f9043ee9991

[Martin68]

54. I guess we could say US foreign policy is currently incoherent, in flux, or just plain

fucked up.

[JohnnyRingo]

29. US and Russia against the Western World. WWIII

I'm pretty sure we the people have to comply so it would take a defining event. At least enough to convince the MAGAs that a nuclear attack is acceptable.

[neohippie]

42. Might want to add China as in favor of being the third Imperial power here

Ukraine war briefing: China lauds Trump’s Russia peace talks


Foreign minister Wang Yi praises ‘consensus’ between Moscow and Washington, reached without Kyiv; Ukraine president voices ‘hope’ after meeting US envoy. What we know on day 1,094

China’s foreign minister said Beijing supported Donald Trump’s bid to work with Russia to end the war. Speaking at the G20 meeting in Johannesburg, Wang Yi did not reiterate a point he made a week earlier at a meeting in Munich, that Ukraine must be involved in any further peace talks. “China supports all efforts conducive to peace [in Ukraine], including the recent consensus reached between the United States and Russia,” Wang said, according to a statement from his ministry. “China is willing to continue playing a constructive role in the political resolution of the crisis,” he added. Wang met Russian foreign minister Sergey Lavrov on the sidelines of the G20, and said relations between their two countries were “moving towards a higher level and broader dimension”. Both men will meet in Moscow soon for their next talks, Lavrov said earlier.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/feb/21/ukraine-war-briefing-china-lauds-trumps-russia-peace-talks

[Kid Berwyn]

52. Perhaps a royal word.

It is the mother of all nightmare scenarios: giving up a free Europe to the Kremlin. The only way for Europe to defend itself would be nukes from the UK and France. Once that genie is out of the bottle, those with the means to survive are advised to get upwind ASAP.

[Marcuse]

47. it could happen and it could be for the best.

[AmericaUnderSiege]

48. NATO is a treaty, so it remains the law.

A 250-year-old Constitution and a 70-year-old treaty bound in both blood and culture carry considerably more weight than some raving creep's dictates. Especially if said raving creep would be hypothetically ordering a superpower military to back down from a fight being brought to its doorstep by a traditional enemy. His treason is already manifest, but that would be making a parade of it.

My greater concern would that he'll start a war with someone else to avoid attention on his treason.

But in general, if he did order the US military to not protect Europe under attack by Russia, DC has had the "mental incapacity" card in its pocket every year he's been in power, and that will only get more potent with time.

[Bluetus]

50. The law explicitly says POTUS cannot do this alone. Why does nobody ever bring up the fact that we have laws?

22 USC 1928f(a) provides that the President cannot withdraw from the North Atlantic Treaty without approval of two-thirds of the Senate, or an Act of Congress.

https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=(title:22%20section:1928f%20edition:prelim)%20OR%20(granuleid:USC-prelim-title22-section1928f)&f=treesort&edition=prelim&num=0&jumpTo=true

[stillcool]

51. the Legislature, the Judiciary, and the Executive

branch are all held in the fist of the President. Seems the law is what they say it is.

[Bluetus]

55. But the media should be able to say it. And Dems should be able to say it?

I understand why Republicans roll over for Trump. I don't understand why everybody else does.

[stillcool]

56. the media is a lost cause

and the Democrats can say and do whatever they want, which those representing me usually do on the floor of the Senate or Congress I think it's getting pretty clear that the people are the only way out of this. I went to a protest on February 5th
just a few weeks after the inauguration. It was the first 50/50 that was put together in a matter of days I caught it on bluesky, and then reddit and decided to go.... along with to my surprise a few hundred other people. All hand-made signs, the chanting was loud, full of energy. It certainly instilled some hope. I think life is changing faster than we can keep up with, but if nothing else, we humans are very adaptable, and there are more of us than we realize

[Bread and Circuses]

53. I support NATO , so I am now actively rooting ....

…For this racist misogynist sewer country to implode. I’ll suffer and you’ll suffer. I’m broken hearted

There’s no putting lipstick on a pig any longer.

Fascism is here and will spread across the globe through the billionaire class.

The Constitutional Republic is on course to be defeated by summer.

The US is aligned with despots, strongmen , and the axis of evil.

It seems that it all has to be burned down if we can’t restore democracy in a few months.
I’m sorry. I’m a reasonable person , but the rot should have been destroyed after the Civil War.
Yes, I’m going there. The southern anarchists and traitors should have ALL been hung and their land confiscated.
The nation attempted to extend an Olive branch, which as we see was a big mistake.

The only thing that the ‘bad guys’ understand is overwhelming brutal force.

If we ever get our country back, every single republican leader, corporate turncoat and billionaire needs to be marched to the guillotine

Hell yes! I’m mad.

What’s crossed me? I’ll be doing a separate post on this.

Thanks DU community

! https://www.kqed.org/news/12027864/trump-moves-slash-presidio-trust-agency-runs-historic-sf-park

https://www.sfgate.com/california-parks/article/yosemite-locksmith-fired-20178362.php