General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsI've learned an important lesson from this election
I went through most of my life honestly believing that most people are generally decent.
I now know for certain that is not the case.
It is a hard thing to finally understand.
XanaDUer2
(13,625 posts)Just where I'm at at age 59.
I wonder, the Latinos who voted for him... will they have to carry papers now to prove their citizens? Its gonna be interesting
Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)There are some that don't but the majority does.
XanaDUer2
(13,625 posts)The ones I know are liberal
But no lots of garbage to go around. Not just one group.
Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)My Father in law was a liberal and catholic. I said that some aren't conservative. I find it hard to place Thomas Merton and Teilhard De Chardin with the likes of Carlo Maria Vigano.
XanaDUer2
(13,625 posts)Lots of awful ppl of all stripes.
Rapist. Check. Spy. Check. Epstein bud. Check. Mass murderer. Check. Incompetent. Check. Microphone blower. Check. Felon. Check. Sociopath. Check.
Lifeafter70
(355 posts)Is nothing but rw catholics and trump supporters. She lives in blue oregon but a very conservative part of the state. Years ago when I was still involved it was more liberal. I have not spoken to her since my dad's funeral, two years ago. My dad also supported trump.
King_Klonopin
(1,337 posts)It is more a reflection of where a person lives geographically.
Catholics are divided 50/50 politically. Abortion is the big wedge issue.
I am fortunate enough to be a Catholic who lives in Massachusetts:
An Irish Catholic, labor union, working class, publicly educated, dyed-in-the-wool Democrat.
Lifeafter70
(355 posts)I was rasied in a large (six kids) Irish Catholic family. My father was a union man working class. He worked on many of the major bridges in California, we grew up in Southern California. Our parrish was very liberal. So I understand what you are talking about.
All that changed when he retired. I had never heard racist words from him growing up, but as an adult I heard a lot. He especially had a hate for Hispanics. He thought they had ruined the construction unions. When he retired he no longer had to watch what he said or hide his true feelings. He voted for trump twice before he passed.
My family is split down the middle. Three siblings who are still practicing Catholics, very conservative and trump supporters. I my sister and younger brother are liberal and left the church at different stages in our lives and for different reasons.
I realize religion or lack of belief are very personal and there are many good Catholics. Unfortunately too many Cardinals and Bishops are not.
I do love the nuns on the bus.
I was a believer well into adulthood and it was not a decision I made lightly.
LisaM
(28,522 posts)He can call himself that all he wants, but he doesn't practice the basic tenet of the faith, which is helping those less fortunate - the least among us.
And yes, I am a liberal Catholic. The churches I grew up with were very progressive.
Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)Hope22
(2,609 posts)Trumper all the way. I Showed up at her house for thanksgiving four Years ago and she was flying the US flag upside down for TSF. Over my lifetime she has called me horrible things because I stand up for those who need help and march for peace and safe missions for troops. She is a despicable trumper. The point is I never would have inverted the flag especially when my mother and grandmother would see it. Only republicans can do these things and get away with it. Im so over all of it. If the church tells her to do something she will!
XanaDUer2
(13,625 posts)There are MAGATs of all stripes. Lots and lots and lots.
calimary
(84,119 posts)But I like flying under the radar so much more. Seems to me its safer, too - perhaps more than ever, starting now. Or certainly by January 20th.
I realize its still only two days on from TERRIBLE TUESDAY. But it seems to me we Dems need at least a bit of recovery or cool-down time. At least a bit. But SOON ENOUGH, for the sake of this country we still love, were gonna have to pronounce ourselves solidly recovered and ready to win, longterm.
Hope22
(2,609 posts)That my sister admonished me over a lifetime of peace vigils and activism, voting for democrats, and speaking out. Had I ever once flipped the flag upside down she would have told me I was a disgrace to my grandparents, father and country. And there she was with an upside down flag that was hanging in disarray. For me if I take a flag down I fold it properly. If it is ripped I repair or burn it. I believe in dressing in orange to show distress. Displaying the flag upside down hanging clean and clear may indeed be necessary at times but doing that for an insurrectionist attempting to hijack this country, I draw the line at that!
On our current situation I have not flown the US flag for several years because I have felt that the MAGATS had hijacked it. This fall when I put my campaign signs at the road I interspersed 12x18 flags amongst them. Back at the house I flew the flag that had draped my grandfathers coffin from the upper deck. It is huge and it really made me happy to display. Screw these people! We have to take back our flag and the integrity of this nation. If I saw an upside down flag flown clean and hanging free I would understand the meaning. If I knew it was for the traitor in chief I would feel differently, if that makes sense. But like you say, flying under the radar at this time makes total sense. We have had election signs lit on fire and shot at on separate occasions. Safety is a real concern. Stay safe!💗💗
Norbert
(6,476 posts)Classic example from that socialist Matthew:
"Then they will answer and say, Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or ill or in prison, and not minister to your needs?
He will answer them, Amen, I say to you, what you did not do for one of these least ones, you did not do for me."
People will go to mass every weekend and hear the Gospels like this, then the wisdom of words like this leave them as soon as they walk out the door and they worship the gospel according to MAGA. I know many of these. It makes you wonder.
Our Archbishop Schnurr has just recently cut ties with the Girl Scouts for whatever reason. I guess the GS is woo woke.
Hope22
(2,609 posts)The only take away from all of my Sunday school and catechism was that Jesus, real or imagined had some very solid ideas. Those lessons have stuck with me. If most Americans ever ran into Jesus they would more than likely treat him with disdain. Regarding the archbishop ... They never stop looking for ways to harm the helpless.
Clearheadsam
(286 posts)do not practice anymore. My sister( 74 years old) who attends church every Sunday says they push the anti abortion thing just about every week at mass. Joe won Catholics by 5 % but we lost this time by 8% 🤷🏼♂️
msfiddlestix
(7,768 posts)XanaDUer2
(13,625 posts)atreides1
(16,344 posts)Catholic and conservative...but they voted for a man who has a history of lying, adultery, failure as a businessman, and has shown no Christian traits at all?
Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)SocialDemocrat61
(2,739 posts)Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)South America has had several RW despots that the conservative catholic church has helped to put into power.
SocialDemocrat61
(2,739 posts)Are you claiming that only Catholics are despots?
Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)SocialDemocrat61
(2,739 posts)a public policy organization that is not affiliated with any religion
I_UndergroundPanther
(12,901 posts)Is an anti American terrorist organization
SocialDemocrat61
(2,739 posts)Bettie
(16,912 posts)and now they will be running our country.
I hope you are doing relatively OK. This must be even more terrifying for you than it is for a lot of us.
Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)But the church in South America has been actively supporting RW. I believe this kind of came to light when Francis became pope. If I remember right there was a group that didn't want him because he was not part of the "conservative". I don't remember the particulars but they had a group kill nuns there because they were considered liberal. This "conservative" group seems to hold most of the power.
There is most definitely a rift in the church.
SocialDemocrat61
(2,739 posts)of singling out Catholics? JFK was Catholic. Biden is Catholic. So is John Kerry, Nancy Pelosi, Kathy Hochul, Bob Casey, Dick Durbin, Kirsten Gillibrand, Mark Kelly, Patty Murray and Sonia Sotomayo as well as many other democrats.
XanaDUer2
(13,625 posts)Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)Doing these things. Example: David Kerish branch davidian is 7th Day Adventist. But the 7th Day Adventist don't do or believe in what he did.
Again the Spanish and the catholic church have had the largest influence in that continent. Nobody expects the Spanish inquisition.
SocialDemocrat61
(2,739 posts)by the Catholic Church. Is AOC part of it too? https://www.ncronline.org/news/aoc-credits-her-catholic-faith-positions-health-care-environment
Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)Since there are books and history. If you want to research a library will have materials. You can google but have to be careful of sources.
SocialDemocrat61
(2,739 posts)Are all the Catholic migrants coming to the southern border just coming here as part of a Catholic plot to take over the United States?
Attilatheblond
(4,234 posts)So, we can't lay it all on a Catholic alter.
Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)But Historically the Spainards and the catholics have had the main influence. If you want to know more there has been several books and articles on this topic.
Attilatheblond
(4,234 posts)And I have cracked a few hundred history books, thank you very much. The church of the Conquistadors is not something I admire or even excuse. But, that was then and this is now, and NOW fundy xian churches have a lot of 'missionaries' in Latin America and the influence spreads among Hispanics here. Just noting the current reality.
As a disclaimer, I hold the Roman Church in low regard & feel they have must to atone for.
keep_left
(2,329 posts)...to make it look like they are a much larger population than they are. Even worse, the more liberal and radical parishes aren't fighting back. I watched the radtrads destroy a campus ministry back in the late '90s, and I've been paying close attention to their machinations since then. They basically control online Catholicism now, so that if you want to see more progressive views, you have to already know the various blogs and sites already. Otherwise, all you get is crap like EWTN, (Ir)-Relevant Radio, Catholic Answers, etc.
https://democraticunderground.com/100219677391#post40 (see paragraph #2-3)
kairos12
(13,238 posts)I applause your optimism.
I prefer the shitter in Trainspotting.
anamnua
(1,367 posts)turkeys voting for an early Christmas.
Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)lapfog_1
(30,058 posts)If they are children of illegals... even if they are now 50 years old... Trump will retroactively reject the "born here citizenship" and the SCOTUS will go along with him.
But they sure did "own the libs" and "close the door behind them"
XanaDUer2
(13,625 posts)On day 1. Will Hispanics have to carry papers now?
I have no idea how he's going to move out millions of humans. The cost? Door-to-door raids looking for them?
Camps to hold them in b4 deportation?
NJCher
(37,681 posts)exorbitantly expensive. They showed a segment on it on 60 Minutes last week. No way the Chaos Administration will have the ability to do it the right way. They'll just be amassing people and shipping them out of the country.
I've heard a couple interviews with young Latino men who are "legal," if you want to put it that way, and they want the newcomers shipped out. They don't seem to realize there will be little to distinguish them and even if they have papers, it's doubtful they'll be looked at carefully. Huge risk to them, I'm thinking.
Demobrat
(9,734 posts)they will be targets. If they think the MAGAt thugs will give a shit about papers they are nuts. Brown skin, foreign accent? Out you go.
Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)GOP operatives have been getting republicans scared of concentration camps even though it's total bs. Now though that is probably the route they will take. But enough people have been exposed to the idea that it won't bother them because they said that was what the liberals were going to do to them. I think they have this weird rule they have to tell you what they are going to do. They project what they are actually planning onto the democrats and then it makes it alright for them to do it.
Clouds Passing
(2,061 posts)BonnieJW
(2,512 posts)Kids can't go to school. No going to the hospital. No reporting criminals who wrong them.
90-percent
(6,876 posts)That's easy. Just take auto mfg and commercial and military aircraft plants by eminent domain. It's a good time to invest in indoor chain link fencing
-90% Jimmy
I_UndergroundPanther
(12,901 posts)SSI social security Medicaid Medicare is being cut to help fund deportations I bet
Yavin4
(36,029 posts)They are the largest voting bloc in America and no Democrat has ever won their majority. Not once. So, let's stop blaming the Latino male vote when it's White men that are the problem.
XanaDUer2
(13,625 posts)But of you're a Trump voter, fuck you. His character is more than clear at this point.
I don't care who you are anymore.
Sable302b
(26 posts)It defies all logic.
BadgerMom
(2,945 posts)Im a white woman. Ive never voted Republican and, I know, never will. Some other white women differ from me and reveal themselves. Wait for that.
My husband is a white man and, also, has never voted Republican. Were unable to recognize the diseased until people tell us who they are.
I know were deeply hurt right now. I know I am. Just be careful.
XanaDUer2
(13,625 posts)Its too raw right now. I'm cutting trumpers out and i don't gaf WHO they are. I'm hearing on tv that white women went for trump bc of "fears' of student protests.
That has nothing to do with me being a white women who vote democratic. I'm not discussing it further with you.
kelly1mm
(5,098 posts)through the same process that Irish Americans and Italian Americans have and are becoming 'white' (especially multiple generation Latinos). I mean this in the sociological sense and (generally) it is a good thing. But as can be seen over that 3 Presidential cycles it is significantly cutting into Democratic Party votes, just like when the Irish and Italians became 'white'
onecaliberal
(35,643 posts)Jk23
(330 posts)The Atlantic had a great article on this yesterday. The Republican party is a Hispanic party.
XanaDUer2
(13,625 posts)If that maniac truly starts rounding up Latinos, and trump-loving citizens get caught up, oh well.
My mom used to say, live your vote
hadEnuf
(2,630 posts)As Olbermann said, the 2 words left for them is "Bye now".
Response to XanaDUer2 (Reply #1)
hadEnuf This message was self-deleted by its author.
blueknight73
(308 posts)Lawrence Massachusetts
Population : 89, 143
Hispanic 82% ( highest in Mass )
Adults w/ college degree 15%
Median household income $58, 079
2016: Clinton + 66
2020: Biden + 48
2024 Harris + 17
kelly1mm
(5,098 posts)to becoming 'white'. I am not necessarily saying this based on skin tone but in the way that there used to be a defined 'Irish vote' and a defined 'Italian vote'. Nobody seriously considers these groups (for electoral purposes for sure) as anything but basic 'white voters'. In a general sociological sense this is a 'good' thing.
Hate all you want, but the GOP has made MASSIVE inroads into the Latino community. While not quite a majority R constituency, they have steadily been heading there over the past 3 cycles.
Mr.Bee
(300 posts)We had overcome racism in the 1970s.
Lemon Lyman
(1,477 posts)Were they ALWAYS this bad? Or did this MF'er just put them all under his spell and turn them into his crazy cult?
Bettie
(16,912 posts)But, suddenly, I'm glad we don't have a large circle of friends, because writing off relatives is hard enough.
Elessar Zappa
(15,658 posts)They were just keeping their mouths shut for the most part until Obamas administration broke their brain and they became more open about it. But yeah, even before Obama, lots of white people would get racist behind closed doors, with close friends and family.
brush
(57,225 posts)Last edited Thu Nov 7, 2024, 11:30 AM - Edit history (1)
I'm African-American and of my nieces married a man from Miami where a lot of Cubans live. He said he's heard some unbelievably racist and misogynistic things there from the white Cubans. Surprising but not surprising I guess, as Cuba has a large demographic of Black Cubans. Seems Cuba has the same pecking order of most of the Caribbean nations, the ruling classes are largely light complexioned and the machismo is there.
One thing to note. Mexico just elected a woman president...a Jewish woman.
Guess the machismo attitude isn't quite everywhere in Latin nations.
Elessar Zappa
(15,658 posts)Theres still misogyny, of course, but theyve really improved, unlike the US, apparently.
CrispyQ
(38,121 posts)I think a lot of white people thought we'd made major inroads on racism & then...Obama. I blame John McCain, the Republican Party, & the media for not shutting Palin & her racist rhetoric down by shaming her, but the party needed the racists to win & the media loved the ratings her vitriol brought in. But she did show the rest of us just how many racists there were & how little progress we've really made. Clinton brought out the misogyny & Harris brought out both.
Blue Full Moon
(959 posts)They will only change if something happens to them personally. They suffer from somebody else and they aren't talking about me syndromes.
Ursus Arctos
(34 posts)podcast today that really helped me understand some important points about how Trump grew his support. On her podcast Fast Politics, Molly Jong Fast talked to Angelo Carusone. He outlined the strategy that Maga has used of appealing to and welcoming into the fold, smaller fringe (often batshit crazy) groups of people through social media--Anti-vaxxers, Q-anon, the he-man woman haters, and of course the eating the dogs and cats people among others. This is accomplished with a huge assist from algorithms. You end up with someone who might disagree with much of what Trump stands for, but he acknowledges their conspiracy theory beliefs, so they feel he understands them. Tucker Carlson's announcement that he was attacked by a demon in his sleep, coupled with Trump's use of the word demonic to describe the Democrats are related. The religious people who really believe that demons are actively at work, hear that and their limbic reward systems light up with a rush of dopamine. That's the "They feel seen" we keep hearing about. There's so much more. It's worth a listen.
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/dahlia-lithwick-angelo-carusone/id1645614328?i=1000675986948
BonnieJW
(2,512 posts)They hid it from polite society. When the beast showed up, they let it fly.
Quiet Em
(866 posts)I thought good people would prevent this from happening again.
Our society has a problem. It's sad.
Ocelot II
(120,393 posts)People can and do act selflessly and bravely and honorably at times, but hundreds of years of history strongly suggest that more often they're just assholes.
CrispyQ
(38,121 posts)Our capitalistic system has become more & more predatory & look out, cuz it's gonna be open season on all of us soon. Worse than it is now.
jmbar2
(6,038 posts)Persistent economic stress can make people go looking for strongmen/saviors. Under all the hoopla about our economy is that it hasn't trickled down much. Hard to say Hooray for rich people's portfolios.
CrispyQ
(38,121 posts)American wealth as pie. This video is dated Jan 2020, so before the rich got even richer during the pandemic. The good part starts at 45 seconds. The old guy is funny. The demo is over when Elizabeth Warren comes on.
jmbar2
(6,038 posts)Kudos to them.
CrispyQ
(38,121 posts)I think a lot of people who think they're on plate 4 are really on plate 3 or even 2. IDK for sure, but I do know that people have no idea just how wealthy the wealthy are.
jmbar2
(6,038 posts)ffr
(23,106 posts)From the graphs I've seen, wealth at the top seems to have grown exponentially after 1980, when Reagan started his presidency.
jmbar2
(6,038 posts)appalachiablue
(42,820 posts)FakeNoose
(35,498 posts)It took a long time and a lot of work to get it going. But it's what made our country great ... or at least good and something to be proud of ... until the late 60's.
With Nixon and almost every R president after him - the New Deal started disappearing. Reagan gave it a very large kick in the groin. I could go on but you get the picture.
CrispyQ
(38,121 posts)Even if it just gave a leg up to your grandparents or great-grands.
atreides1
(16,344 posts)Acts of bravery and honor have never been performed by large groups.
brush
(57,225 posts)CrispyQ
(38,121 posts)Unfortunately, women & minorities didn't have any say back when the rich, white founders were drawing up documents. (Pretty much the same in all patriarchal societies.) The rest of us were allowed to participate in their democracy as long as we kept to our place. I guess they never thought that when they based the country on "all men are created equal" the rest of us might question why we weren't included, why we weren't equal. Now, a bunch of privileged (mostly) white men are throwing a king-sized temper tantrum cuz they think only they are capable of running things. And here we stand on an ecological brink brought on by their policies & they still think they deserve to be in charge. And apparently so do a lot of women & minorities.
City Lights
(25,241 posts)We are surrounded by moronic, selfish idiots who have no idea what is actually happening, nor what they just voted for.
Bettie
(16,912 posts)with their memes about "Don't end friendships over politics!".....except, it isn't politics, it's basic morality.
ETA: It's about values, that's the word I was looking for. They don't share mine.
City Lights
(25,241 posts)progressoid
(50,712 posts)that he loves even more.
Bettie
(16,912 posts)has a bunch of bodies buried in his back yard or basement and he still expects you to come over for the barbeque.
voteragain
(15 posts)again, I was raised by republicans many years ago.
nothing has changed with them and their outlook on life and how it's supposed to be here.
remember George Wallace?
Reagan that said " I did not leave the Democratic Party, it left me "
remember the assassinations of the Kennedy's?
the MIC and the forever wars?
hate is the foundation of the USA.......
remember that the slavers that started this country?
here's what I must say, if you want change you have to have the power to make change.
that means you must sometimes have to compromise your emotion with reality when you vote.
it may not be your favorite person but is that person going to help you achieve change in the real world of politics.
if if if we have a chance at another shot to save DEMOCRACY, first get the power to do so..........
kimbutgar
(23,164 posts)Last edited Thu Nov 7, 2024, 03:31 PM - Edit history (1)
I am so mad at PA, MI, WISC, NC and AZ. Shame on them.
Maeve
(42,921 posts)In part because, in a group, we're stupid. We are easily led and influenced to bad behavior as a survival tactic. That's why we have a term like "mass hysteria" but not "mass kindness".
Eventually, tho, the hysteria ends and enough realize they are wrong.
At least, that's what I keep telling myself.
LizBeth
(10,752 posts)This election confirms I am right solidly and I have only Repub dad in my life. Not another single one. Can't do it and they do not deserve me, lol and my kindness/compassion/joy.
anamnua
(1,367 posts)I am still trying to get my head around the fact that the most powerful, technologically advanced country in the world, 'the shining city on the hill', just elected a convicted rapist/felon/narcissist/sociopath/fraudster/insurrectionist as its leader.
FirstLight
(13,960 posts)I think that's why I was abused by partners, thinking people are inherently good.
There is such a thing as dark-hearted... and unfortunately, we're surrounded by them
Docreed2003
(17,718 posts)Most peoples care for others ends at the tips of their noses. We are an incredibly selfish and self centered society.
Lifeafter70
(355 posts)They care when their shoes get tight.
Wingus Dingus
(8,400 posts)Greed for themselves and fuck-you, loser! to everyone else. You can't feel like a winner unless someone else is losing. That's where we are as a society.
Bettie
(16,912 posts)"reality" shows...."Real Housewives" and such. I watched half an episode of one of them once and it was so mean-spirited and awful, I turned it off.
And this is what so many want to see, what so many want to be.
Maybe I just don't belong anywhere anymore.
Wingus Dingus
(8,400 posts)I follow birding, gardening, geology, history, music, cooking, art and animal-rescue content on Instagram and YouTube, and re-watch all of my favorite sitcoms from the last few decades, and try to escape the nastiness and degradation of our culture that way. Also I try to get out into nature, it's healing and life-affirming.
misanthrope
(8,139 posts)This is what that era brought us. Even the POTUS-elect first found his fame and foothold into the American consciousness then.
Skittles
(158,410 posts)America has never truly recovered.
Pacifist Patriot
(24,887 posts)Johnny2X2X
(21,678 posts)It's a post truth world and evil forces saw it becoming that and took advantage before the forces of good could put on their boots.
It's a tough thing to say and people will call it elitist, but the average person is just not equipped to make sense out of the avalanche of information that bombards them every moment on the internet. I can recognize myself struggling with that more and more. And just when I thought I got good at weeding out fake articles and fake quotes, fake videos and photos have come along. I now regularly see videos of public figures saying things that they never said, sometimes I spot them easily and can track them down, but am I getting all of them? Am I seeing videos and thinking, "Man, that was an awful thing to say" and then just moving on? It's like drinking from a fire hose right now.
And it's only going to get worse, we let the social media monster loose on the town before we even knew the first thing about controlling it, and we've currently unleashed AI which will be a thousand times worse.
jayschool2013
(2,459 posts)I just finished Steven Brill's "The Death of Truth: How Social Media and the Internet Gave Snake Oil Salesmen and Demagogues the Weapons They Needed to Destroy Trust and Polarize the World--And What We Can Do."
Your thesis is the same as his. The book provides the details on how the convergence of social media algorithms, authoritarian states' propaganda arms, and the short-attention spans of American consumers led to the demise of truthful media and pushed people onto bullshit sites like Xhitter, Farcebook, and Instacrap for their "news."
Johnny2X2X
(21,678 posts)We just kind of launched the internet and gave little thought to it. People talked about what regulations looked like, but you know which side fought tooth and nail against regulation. Then social media was out and shaping all of our minds before anyone even really knew how things worked and what was happening. Heck, most people today have no idea that your every move is being tracked on the internet. People don't realize that when you leave Facebook, Facebook bots follow you and log what sites you went to, how long you stayed there, and what you looked at.
And the very definition of social media is blurred. I've seen many a DU poster claiming, "I don't do social media at all, I have zero accounts." OK, um...but you're here on a message board, which is a form of social media, posting.
And people think of being tracked in terms of some guy somewhere logging something, it's njot a guy, but a computer program or AI that is just using tools it has to create a psychological profile of you. That profile was used to sell you things at first, but now it is being used to shape the way you think and even the way you feel.
And people talk about the uncanniness of advertisements like they're spooky. "I had mentioned to my neighbor just the other day while out for a walk that this herbacide is good for that Nutsedge weed they have on their lawn, and then low and behold, I see an advertisement for that very thing later that night." People will claim, "They're listening to you through your phone or some other way." But it's actually a lot more creepy than being spied on with a listening device. They didn't spy on your words, they spied on your thoughts and feelings and then maybe manipulated them. They know you better than you know your self, and they're using a detailed profile of you that is probably more predictive of your future behavior than your own words would be. And by they, I mean some namless, feelingless set of 1s and 0s somewhere.
So that is the power that fascists have seized on to take over our country. And their aim isn't to spread prosperity and peace, it's to spread chaos, confusion, and take away people's freedoms because in their hearts they are against self governance and determination.
Elessar Zappa
(15,658 posts)Or were in for an indefinite period of right wing dominance. Hell if I know what we should do though.
Johnny2X2X
(21,678 posts)It's all a bunch of ruthless sociopaths using AI and social media to subjugate people and turn them on each other. Unless someone comes along who uses this power for absolute good and for altruistic reasons, it's going to continue being this group of thugs running things.
Dawson Leery
(19,364 posts)No hate radio, no internet.
The big three broadcasters and a few major respectable papers.
Trust_Reality
(1,849 posts)There is an old saying, "When someone says 'It's not about the money, it's the money'".
Here is a new one: When a voter says it's the economy, it's not the economy. It is ego or fear or racism. (something they are ashamed to admit).
A world class con man with a lifetime of appeasement and successful bullying has easily beaten the best presidential candidate I have seen in my lifetime.
Unbelievable.
My initial response is to subscribe or donate regularly to ACLU, The Guardian News, CREW, DU, and probably AOC.
As Rachel and Kamala are saying, we need to stay engaged.
Martin68
(24,475 posts)BigmanPigman
(52,208 posts)and this election has confirmed my opinion. I am a realist. I keep saying out loud to myself, "I knew it, I knew it". I'm 62 but I have aged over 20 years in the last 8. My Plan B is going into action.
Oopsie Daisy
(4,424 posts)* who seem to be more interested in grandstanding, and showing poor judgement and selfishness in trying to punish the Democratic party by intentionally kneecapping our candidate and depressing voter turnout. I've come to expect it from folks like Susan, Jill, Jane Nina and Michael... but I take it much more personally when the crippling wounds are delivered by someone who should know better.
stollen
(521 posts)Subjugation of the native population and 400 years of slavery...
All it took was a messianic speaker to unleash what frail laws we had to keep that bottled up.
ismnotwasm
(42,433 posts)She died in a horrible motorcycle accident. Her people are all bikers. They showed up for her funeral in love and support. They brought food, love and laughter. They still support my grieving BIL in anyway they can. Their motorcycle group does things like toy runs, scholarships, patriot guard for vets
My brother in law warned us not to tell anyone we were voting for Kamala Harris. Saw a couple Bikers for Trump patches
They werent MAGA, exactly. They arent garbage either. At least not to each other.
Saw an old co-worker of minea Filipino immigrant post something on FB about how JFK JR was going to stop fluoride in water and vaccine mandates and how she was all for it. I hadnt seen this kind of crap from her before. She is an excellent nurse and a generous person. She fought for months for her little daughter who had cancer. Shes not garbage either
(I unfriended her anyway, because anything JFK JR well thats a bridge too far in my FB tolerance meter)
I live in Seattle. I can avoid most MAGA interactions. My state is blue and prosperous. We just elected yet another Democratic governor and attorney general. I realize, in this moment in time, I am privileged.
What I am saying is people who deliberately choose the path of bigotry and hatred are certainly garbage, but most people are not. Just trying to fit in with their social groups. It takes real courage to break out.
Some of them are garbage, some of them are moral cowards but most of them are indoctrinated to not accept information outside of bias.
jmbar2
(6,038 posts)If you subtract all brain worms that they caught in the past 20 years
- Obama/Hillary bashing
- Distrust of reputable news
- QAnon
- Vax denial
- Immigrant, LGBTQ bashing
- "Owning the libs"
... they are more like us than not. They have brain worms. Maybe they will get over them at some point. Some are reachable, given time.
ismnotwasm
(42,433 posts)And I didnt mean to imply that. My thought is, to themselves they are not garbage. To themselves, they are not even wrong.
Trump for all his bumbling touched right to the heart of America, right to the heart of our white supremacist roots. Right to our rot. Hes clever that way.
misanthrope
(8,139 posts)I believe you're thinking of his lunatic cousin, who is a complete reprobate.
Stargleamer
(2,169 posts)Last edited Fri Nov 8, 2024, 01:24 PM - Edit history (1)
Just trying to fit in with their social groups is often, if not always, ones conscience
Colgate 64
(14,829 posts)"You can't fix stupid".
LAS14
(14,551 posts)ananda
(30,630 posts)Thats been a hard lesson for me too.
Iggo
(48,220 posts)Old Crank
(4,555 posts)But seems to have been a lie.
I had always thought that humanity is in a continuous, if dlow, advancement to a more human condition.
It would appear that the human condition is dominated by vile humans.
misanthrope
(8,139 posts)**
geo1
(81 posts)If it weren't for knowing about all the good folks here at DU who have worked so hard for Democratic candidates over the years, and who will continue to do so , would be hard to get through another day.
BluenFLA
(151 posts)FakeNoose
(35,498 posts)Chump will take us out of NATO first chance he gets. Then what? All hell breaks loose.
This is nothing to be proud of.
misanthrope
(8,139 posts)I think the bow of our boat is out over the falls and tipping downward.
walkingman
(8,271 posts)mymomwasright
(360 posts)Many of the people, not so much!
BarbD
(1,215 posts)We live in a country where the South is still fighting the Civil War. We worship money. The song from the Broadway musical "South Pacific" says it all: "We have to be carefully taught. Before we are six or seven or eight to hate all the people our relatives hate. We have to be carefully taught."
OldBaldy1701E
(6,221 posts)paulrevere2018
(46 posts)like decent people and they were perfectly OK with owning and their friends owning slaves.
moondust
(20,392 posts)I've suspected a big motivator for the oligarchs is the desire to be above the law so they can do whatever they want. With Project 2025 aren't they basically planning to demolish the federal government, particularly the laws and regulations that "threaten" them and their greedy predation? The prosecutor is definitely not the person who will get that done for them or hand out pardons.
There are probably quite a few low-information voters who don't pay much attention to politics and can be easily swayed by friends and disinformation. Among them are probably many who just know that the cost of living is too damn high and we've gotta change things! They may not acknowledge that Biden and Harris did not raise those prices, and that not all "change" is for the better. This choice could very well turn out much worse for them.
Dawson Leery
(19,364 posts)This election shows why.
People are basically selfish and willfully ignorant.
Can't say I ever had sympathy for those under "Little Boy".
4catsmom
(202 posts)not sure if we'll still be standing by the time this passes
Eliot Rosewater
(32,528 posts)Cant be.
Demobrat
(9,734 posts)The 2024 candidate was a woman. See where Im going with this?
Im not surprised at all. This country hates women.
Semperviren
(4 posts)I have never believed that people are basically decent. We evolved from killer ape like creatures and in many ways we are still that. The only species other than bees and ants that wage war are chimpanzees (our closest relatives) and us.
We have to learn to be decent, critically thinking and considerate individuals, and many havent. We dont have to learn to like power, be selfish or lie or steal or kill, these are innate.
misanthrope
(8,139 posts)"We have to learn to be decent, critically thinking and considerate individuals, and many most havent. We dont have to learn to like power, be selfish or lie or steal or kill, these are innate."
raccoon
(31,419 posts)Bettie
(16,912 posts)them being misled or lied to...I hoped that they weren't as bad as I thought.
Now, all doubt has been removed.
We have a county Dem party meeting next week. I have to go, but it feels futile.
MisterG
(18 posts)71% did not. Not too bad.
Demobrat
(9,734 posts)That realization will keep you safe.
brettdale
(12,559 posts)Than decent people.
DemonGoddess
(5,071 posts)to most of the people I encounter. But, that's me. IMO, most of the people I've encountered over time are not worth the meat sack they inhabit.
Response to Bettie (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Joinfortmill
(16,331 posts)paulkienitz
(1,316 posts)Most of them are perfectly capable of behaving kindly and decently. But inside their minds the dots are left unconnected, and they don't understand, or don't let themselves understand, that what they're voting for is in conflict with the way they like to treat people around them on a personal level. They think they're voting for freedom when they're supporting oppression, they see themselves as embodying kindness yet they enable cruelty, they identify themselves as upholders of the law while they break it, and they have no idea why anyone would ever think they were racist. The people in the Jan 6 insurrection seem to have mostly been wrapped up in some Walter Mitty heroic fantasy; many of them came to a horrible realization later on when they comprehended what they had actually done. (Being dragged into court and charged with a felony does help encourage this realization.) There's always a disconnect, always an element of self-delusion. You'd think that this would only affect a minority but it seems to be the norm among them. I'm guessing that for a lot of them this comes out of being raised with the kind of religion that demands to be believed in without evidence, so their minds are primed for believing lies in any area where the truth would create any conflict with their community. They end up supporting oppressive authoritarianism, yet if the day ever comes when they find themselves subject to authoritarian oppression, they'll be astonished and shocked and have no idea how it could have happened. They won't let themselves understand what they are doing.
Starlight27
(2 posts)Last edited Thu Nov 7, 2024, 08:56 PM - Edit history (1)
Trump just gave everyone permission to be the worst person they can be. People are more than happy to do it. Lazy, stupid, selfish and mean. Lie all the time, think you can do no wrong and always look to blame other people. Some Christian Nation we are. What exactly are people learning in these churches ?
B.See
(3,409 posts)welcome to the club.
moniss
(5,518 posts)and I can honestly say that less than maybe 15 or 20 of those people are ones I would have sit at a table to share a meal.
mamacita75
(112 posts)that makes me want to weep. I was so idealistic as a young 20-year-old. 47 years later I want to hold on to the little idealism I retain. I am surprised I have any at all. TY Bettie.
Trueblue Texan
(2,896 posts)All of life, including humanity is nothing but potential. Humans have the ability to be conscious about controlling the direction of their potentialmost choose not to be conscious about that, however. Each decision we make, whether we are conscious or not and no matter how insignificant the decision, develops some potential within us and we gather momentum toward that potential each time we choose to make a decision in a given direction. What has happened is the morons who support Trump started out making tiny decisions to overlook his flaws, to rationalize the evils he committed. As they continued to develop their potential in the direction of accepting evil, they became more evil themselves so that they could no longer easily discern evil when it was right in front of them. This is exactly what happened to the fascists who supported the Nazis in the 30s and 40s in Europe. It happens slowly at first, then snowballs ever faster into an avalanche of evil. Resist it, shine a light on it, make it obvious for anyone who is still conscious and has the ability to wake up and pull themselves out of its gravitational field.
I_UndergroundPanther
(12,901 posts)Because people with narcissism authoritarian and sociopath personalities have increased in numbers vs the non toxic people we reached some sort of critical mass where the number of voters who are toxic personalities overwhelmed regular voters. When the narcissists and sociopaths saw one of thier kindrunning they came out to vote in droves.
Bullies support each other. Its called a gang, a crime ring, ect.
Montauk6
(8,542 posts)Geiger counters would sound like a Buddy Rich solo.